© Ed Seykota, 2003 - 2006 ... Write for permission to reprint.

Ed Seykota's

Frequently Asked Questions

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August 11 - 20, 2006


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(Quotes from Ed in Red)


Sun, 20 Aug 2006


TTP Love Letter

(excerpt from one Tribe Member to Another)

... Thank you for being willing to send your deep feelings and for allowing me to receive you. I feel invigoration and willingness to go deep with you. I treasure our connection and how my own feelings and k-nots link up with you and yours.

Something continues to shift in me. I experience our connection as a large open pipe through which we experience the gift of intimacy and help each other grow.

I commit is to keeping the pipe open and to keep  growing with you. I feel joy and excitement about going wherever the process takes us.

It feels like a curtain is lifting for both of us. I can hardly wait to see and feel what's ahead and I know I don't have to wait to experience what's now.

Thank you for sharing your process.






Loving Relationships


provide an opportunity


to increase bandwidth.


Clip: http://www.msa.saccounty.net/news/


Sun, 20 Aug 2006


Experiment with Remote Attendance

I'm looking to perform an experiment by attending your IV Tribe meeting non-locally, meaning that I will not actually attend the meeting, but go through the motions of attending (drumming, hotseat, snapshot, etc) based on the agenda of your meeting.

I know it sounds weird, and it's DIM, but would you be so kind as to play along with me? It has to do with the following from your FAQ:

Ed's ultimate intention for The Trading Tribe and for TTP is for people to experience it, and for it to disappear and become just another passing AHA.

I would simply need to know the next date of your meeting and agenda if different from your TTID. I would need to know the time that you drum;  before snapshot process or before TTP process or both.

If you are willing to play along with me and respond or post a reply to the FAQ, I would email you back to commit to attending non-locally. The only other thing that I would ask is that during check-in you announce to the group that someone is attending non-locally.

I'm going to compare the experience I have with a DIM experience, and attending my own tribe meeting, actually and non-locally. I'll report my findings to you.

Thanks for your consideration,

The Snapshot Process and the Tribe Meeting follow their own path.  I do not pre-schedule a minute-by-minute agenda for the meetings or attempt to predict "drumming times" in the non-existing future.


I plan to host the next IV Tribe meeting, starting at about 2:00 PM.



Sun, 20 Aug 2006


New Tribes







Cambridge, England


Sunnyvale California


Bangalore, India


Las Vegas, Nevada


Sat, 19 Aug 2006


Hot Seat Report - Positive Intention of Pain



In our recent tribe meeting I find that the process continues to evolve, with More “work” getting done in the snapshot process, perhaps requiring less Remaining to be done in the tribe meeting on the hot seat.  All of our members Have been at this a while now, and it has become a deeper and more efficient Process.


We individually recite the commitments made at the last meeting and then present Evidence to the other members that we fulfilled them.  Members hold each Other to high standards, and sign off only if it is very clear that the commitments were met.  Failing to meet commitments brings up feelings that are usually key to something Fred has been busy with in the background.


In the second round, new or modified snapshots and new commitments are presented and feedback is given and received.  While this often takes much time, we find that much of the needed work for some members is accomplished.


In my process, I find that I have strong feelings of anguish and pain in my chest And neck when arriving at an impasse in my fitness, trading, and musical snapshot commitments. 


I thought the issues were surely different between the snapshots,  but the feelings seemed the same when I opened up and let them flow.


After a break for dinner which we prepare together, we begin the tribe meeting. I feel “hot” since the snapshot process and take the first hotseat.  When I get Into it, I find myself in a form that is familiar to me.  I am on my knees in the Center of the room, head back, back arched, and arms stretched back behind me.


I scream, perhaps in agony, at first.  I take it as hard and far as I can.  I repeat  This again and again.  The Process Manager asks if I am willing to do it again And this time try to enjoy it.  I say, “Yes!"  I use the freeze technique.  I have an image of being lifted off the ground by ropes attached to hooks which are connected to the skin and muscles of my anterior chest.  There is a lot of pain. I feel that I transcend the normal understanding of pain.  After this AHA, my screams are of ecstasy and joy. 


I collapse onto the floor with my arms and legs outstretched, numb, motionless, And feeling free.  I see pain as my friend.  It is necessary for health.  One must be conscious of pain and assess its meaning.  Quite often, one should avoid that Which causes pain as health will be adversely affected. 


Other times, however, It is OK to push through the pain.  I feel that my body has more intelligence About how to make this determination now.  This feels deeply empowering.


I thank my tribe for their support.

Thank you for sharing your process.






helps us operate within safe limits.


Pain in a k-not


entrains drama about exceeding these limits.



Clip: http://www.listenforjoy.com/art/large/


Sat, 19 Aug 2006


TTP memberships


I'm a novice scalp trader and not a very good one. I've been working with a group of traders (two professional and mostly novices) for about two years. I lost a lot of money and I wish I hadn't been so "gung ho," but I don't regret it.


What I'm concerned about is repeating the same mistakes and not having the ability to correct these faults.

I've read numerous books and attended seminars and I still feel the same. I don't believe there has been a transformation in me because my trading results are the same ... loss.


I try try try and never seem to make a real transformation and feel the same way about my trading. I feel I need something, an awakening an edge or something to make a difference in my abilities.


But at the same time I know it's a very simple thing to do. For example, when scalping I search for stocks that are breaking new highs and new lows.


That's all I need to know and all I need to search for but there's something inside of me that wants to do more, for example buy/short a pull back. It's unnecessary to do so and I can justify to why I shouldn't during this email but I'll do it anyway during trading hours.

I've read of Fred, CM and the TTP and was wondering would this help me?

FAQ does not make predictions, about the markets or about what might happen to you if you engage the process.

Sat, 19 Aug 2006


Perhaps President Bill could use a Hotseat Session

Hi Ed,


I hate age 60

-- Bill Clinton

Source: http://news.ninemsn.com.au/


Bill can likely find a Tribe nearby if he wants to take the hot seat.

Fri, 18 Aug 2006


Bernoulli Principle



The site says:


"That means the upper flow of air is faster and, according to Bernoulli's Principle, the pressure is less above the wing."


I do not agree that the conclusion follows from Bernoulli's Principle. The configuration involves variations in density. 

Thu, 17 Aug 2006


Cambridge Workshop feedback

Hello Ed,

I am writing you about my experience at the Cambridge workshop and the days following the workshop:

2006-07-23: The TTP Workshop is over since about 3 hours and I am sitting here in Cambridge in front of King's College to log an issue which I plan to take into the next meeting of my local tribe:

I recall Friday evening. During the first evening of the workshop Ed asks me a question and I struggle internally to find an answer. All I can say is "I don't know".


While saying so I pull down the ends of my lips, put head a bit to the back, stretch my neck, pull up my hands in front of my breast and stretch the fingers upward.


Ed says: "Do it again, this is your form". I repeat it about three times. Later the evening our task is to go into forms. I choose that form. I manage to go inside that form. It is intense. At a certain moment my arms move automatically. It seems like I found resonance frequency of that movement.

I recall Saturday: Our task is to develop a snapshot. I have a rough idea about what I want, but I can't find out about an important point of my snapshot.


While presenting the snapshot in the big round, my form appears again while saying "I don't know". Ed immediately points this out and asks me to repeat the form several times. I wonder that he remembers a single form of a single participant because we were a lot of participants and that form was among hundreds of forms he sees during a workshop.


Later the day I walk outside of the hotel in the road. A woman stops her car next to me and asks me the road to a place. I notice myself saying "I don't know" while playing my form. I wonder that I notice that form now. I guess I am using this form for years. In the evening we have our TTPs.


When it is my turn I first have some problems to get into that form. I often notice that it is very loud in the room. Several TTPs are running simultaneously and we use drums to enhance the field of acknowledgement.


Finally I get into my form. I go through the movement with my arms and arrive at throwing my head back. That hurts a little in the muscles of my neck. I strongly close my eyes and tear the ends of my lips down. The process ends. I feel exhausted. I feel a little bit of ache in the back of my head but I am not able to go inside that any more. I simply feel exhausted.

I recall Sunday just after the checkout on my way to the bathroom: Charles comes to me and says: "I have to say something to you".


I feel some symptoms of nice surprise and stress, which is a prickle under my stomach. He continues: "One says the first million is the hardest. The first hundred thousand are the hardest. The first ten thousand are the hardest." I wonder whether he is referring to trading, but he clarifies that he is referring to me and the TTP: "I could really see your willingness this time".


Immediately I felt a potato in my throat and I am just able to say "thank you". I guess that Charles notices that I am not able to take his words as an encouragement like he intended. He suggests me to go where I was about to go. I feel sad, incapable: Tears are coming into my eyes and I feel a big potato in my throat.


I go up to my room and cry. Crying is something which I do seldom, but which I am able to do since the Reno 2005 workshop. I feel released after crying. Later I accompany my tribe leader to the bus. I am barely able to tell him about this issue for our next tribe meeting, because I feel the potato in my throat again and I don't want to start crying in the roads of Cambridge.


Later I walk around alone. I pass by Kings College. I hear the sound of a saxophone coming from a bar. Immediately there is the potato and the urge to cry. I recall and incidence of 1988: We are sitting with the family and friends at a table.


I tell my dad that I want to learn to play saxophone.

He tells me "You are like me. You are not able to do these things." I remember that I have the same feelings in that moment like the once I have now. I recall other incidences. I feel really clumsy and unable to do stuff where feelings and emotions are involved, like playing an instrument, dancing and now TTP. I am amazed that I can see this link now.


I walk around Cambridge to find a bank to sit down and log this issue. I don't find a bank to sit down. There was one free but I didn't like it. So I go on searching for a place to sit down. Suddenly I recognize that I am going to King's College where is a wall one can sit on and where is the bar with the saxophone music.


I wonder if Fred is bringing me to the bar with the saxophone music again to feel that feeling again. I feel the hair on the back of my head rising. A feeling I usually get when something strange, unexplainable happens. I am grateful that this old issue is lying there right in front of me ready to go through. I see clearly how feeling incapable to do things where emotions and feelings are involved is standing between me and living my life. I also see that I must behave strangely when people say something positive or encouraging to me related to emotions and feelings. I am looking forward to bring the issue into the next meeting of our local trading tribe.

2006-07-24: I am back in the office. I have a walk outside during lunch break. I am walking slowly and thinking about the issue. I am remembering precisely the setting of the situation where I hear that playing the saxophone is nothing for me.


While having this situation in front of my inner eye I hear somebody doing exercises on a saxophone. The sound is coming from a house near by while I walk. I notice my hair rising and a shower going down my back, the feelings Fred is always playing when something is happening that seems supernatural to me. The feeling changes. Tears are coming into my eyes. It seems that something happened during the workshop so that Fred sees and takes every occasion to play these feelings of being hurt again. My throat still feels like having a potato inside while I write this. I am looking forward to the tribe meeting we are planning for 2006-07-29.

2006-07-29: I take this issue inside a TTP in my local tribe. I get inside easily. The urge to cry and the potato are there immediately when I present the issue to my tribe. I also integrate the forms I remember from the workshop. Then my process manager notices that I am scratching my legs. He suggests me to do more of the scratching. I scratch wherever I notice an itching feeling: my head, my arms, my legs. I scratch and scratch alternating with the other forms. The process is very intense for me and I feel good and happy at the end.

2006-08-17: Now I am sitting here copying the text from my hand written notes into this e-mail. I am feeling easy about this issue. The feeling of the potato in the throat and the urge to cry are gone and they don't come up when I think about the issue. This issue seems so far away to me now.

I thank Ed, Charles, Jason, all workshop participants and my local tribe for helping me to untie this knot.

I also feel the need to write that I am very impressed by all the energy Ed, Charles, Jason and their friends put into taking the TTP out into the world.

Thank you for sharing your process.











The Process of Untying K-nots


often brings forth a rush

of memories and images


and new ways to hold them.










Thu, 17 Aug 2006


Forcing an Aha

Hi Ed,

Greetings  . . . . . and (better late than never) happy birthday 'sweet six-tee'.

I come to realize that one of the things that prevents me from a full experience of the 'hotseat' process is my expectation of wanting something to happen.

I get into my forms without any dramas (excuse the pun) and with tribe validation I am able to go much deeper into the form. Once I'm fully into the form I feel as though I want something to happen, like a glorious insight, a Zen like flash or a moment of clarity. In short, I expect an a-ha that will cure my ills.

Rather than just be with the feeling of the form and not expecting anything in particular I find myself being all 'intellectual' about the process whilst in the form and as stated above, I expect something to happen.

I have tried taking the feeling of 'wanting something to happen' to the hotseat and of course what happens . . . . . I want something to happen whilst I'm experiencing the feeling.

It's as though I'm trying to 'force it' rather than just letting it happen.

Similarly, in the Market environment I'm aware that on occasions I 'force' the trade, rather than just let it happen when it's ready to happen and more often than not, when I do this, it is to my detriment
I am interested to hear your comments re: the above.

You might consider taking your feelings of wanting to push to the hot seat.





May the Force Be With You


Even Yoda

occasionally has to

pick up the light saber


in order to Git 'er Done



Clip: http://www.latrobe.edu.au/podiatry/


Wed, 16 Aug 2006


Breathwork Update

Dear Ed,

Thank you for your hospitality and the Breathwork weekend which has a tremendous impact on me. I feel grateful towards Jason for probing me during the final checkout and everyone else for supporting me

during the whole weekend.


I feel many issues are dissolved and no longer with me. The knot is no longer in my stomach and I am at ease with myself. I no longer feel that I have to hide my past from myself or others. On Saturday morning, a week after the Breathwork, I wake up to find myself waving my right hand the same way I wave during my Breathwork experience, this time without feelings of sadness or tears.


I am ok about this issue and feel calm and peaceful. On the same morning I do exactly as I draw after my Breathwork (I lay flowers on the graves and feel very calm). There have been times where I have not visited the cemetery for over 5 years. I avoid my feelings of grief at all costs. I am amazed at how easy I find this now.

I also begin to realign relationships with friends, colleagues and family. I feel that I no longer need approval or to be Mr. Nice Guy.


I now feel conflict is necessary and no longer feel the need to avoid it. I arrange meetings with several persons to re-align relationships and intend to enjoy being honest and upfront about my feelings and also find that no-one can argue with that. I am determined to remove manipulative and dramatic relationships out of my life.

I remain committed to feel my feelings and enjoy them whatever they may be. I feel by going this way I can achieve my dreams, stop holding myself back and slamming the breaks and running the other way as I have done many times before with my relationships, career and other areas of my life. I am aware that I have only touched the surface of my issues during the workshop and Breathwork however I feel certain that this is the path to achieving my right livelihood whatever that may be.


During the IV tribe meeting on August 3rd I make commitments to send you evidence of moving towards my snapshots for the next IV tribe meeting.

Regarding my right livelihood snapshot of starting my own successful money management firm please see attached an outline for developing my system which I have broken down into 3 main components. I am working on component 1 now. My 30th September deadline may be setting me up for drama however I remain determined to achieve it and intend to enjoy the feelings of over committing if I don’t.

Concerning my relationship snapshot I commit to having a happy marriage. The past weekend I take my girlfriend away to a beach resort.


While on the sun beds and we have a conversation about life and my snapshots and all of a sudden I ask her to marry me. She is surprised, we have a giggle and she accepts. Simple as that!


We intend to take our parents out this weekend. I will send a photo as evidence early next week. Moving on with my life and my girlfriend is the second picture I draw after my Breathwork experience. Ed I feel that a wall has been removed from in front of me and I can now just get on with my life. I feel free like never before.

As for my fun snapshot and setting up a tribe in [Copuntry] I talk to 3 people (I commit to 5 during the snapshot process) who I believe may be interested in joining a tribe and recommend they read more about TTP on your site. I have spoken to [Name] twice since coming back and we intend to start the tribe in September, after the summer holidays.

Please see attached evidence of my subscription to the half marathon I have signed up for as preparation for a full marathon, my body snapshot. I also attach my training schedule which will start on Monday 21st August for 12 weeks. I have not been to the gym or been jogging since returning from Incline Village.

Since coming back I feel like a different person.


I look forward to working on my snapshots and intend to take pleasure in the journey of achieving them. Thank you Ed for helping me and opening a whole new world of self discovery in front of me.

Thank you for sharing your process.

Tue, 15 Aug 2006




Did you change the rules for the example Donchian System? I could be mistaken, but I believe it was 120-120 and 10% risk before, now you show 210-210 and 7% risk. What was the reason for the change?

Thanks for doing FAQ it is a great service to all, as well as yourself!


The 210 seems to work a little better.

Mon, 14 Aug 2006


About Programming ...

Hi Ed,

just few ideas and questions that come to my mind ...
I read the C# Atr code you post Sat, 29 Jul 2006 and today, 1 Aug, I see another contribution by a faq reader. I don't know C# and use another programming language to write and test systems, but I feel it's a great thing to speak a common syntax and share what we know.

1) Do you think we could adopt C# as the 'standard' language to use by all of us interested in following the TT developments (not an obligation, of course) ?

2) What about a new thread on TT web site on programming as a meeting point to discuss and share pieces of code ?

3) I'm curious about your experience with C++ and the advantages that motivate you to learn C#:

P.S.: I allegate

a) the code I write to test ExpAvg system: I'm sure it's clear enough also for non-programmers
b) the output of the optimization process (it's in descending order relatively to the bliss function).

You might consider taking your feelings about wanting a common standard to the hot seat.






tends to occur where people

are unwilling to experience




Clip: http://www.clearlyno.com/ben/blog/


Mon, 14 Aug 2006


Long Term / Short Term Systems

Hi Ed,

You've written often about the advantages of longer term over short term trading systems.

The primary advantage, at least that I've seen you write about, is the lower transaction costs associated with lower trading frequency.

Are there, in your opinion, other advantages associated with longer term systems versus short term? If so would you please elaborate.

As trading frequency increases, the gain per trade decreases while the transaction costs remain constant - so the ratio deteriorates.


Transaction costs are a big factor in day-trading systems.


People may like day trading for the sense of urgency and distraction (from experiencing feelings) it provides.








Cutting Losses

Day Trading

Not Urgent

Research /

Following a system

Watching TV





Mon, 14 Aug 2006


Cambridge Workshop Feedback

Hi Ed,

I return from the Cambridge Workshop to a busy work schedule. I am more in touch with my feelings and body sensations.

A recent email from my boss invokes a not unfamiliar "gut reaction". I acknowledge the feeling and decide to take a different approach; I go with the feeling, look for the good intention, encounter some judges and have at least one AHA experience. The ensuing meeting with him is the most positive I experience in many months; the exchange is honest and positive; I come away from the meeting with an increased sense of self-worth and achievement.

This stuff works!

The workshop opens a crack in the door to a new way of being in the world. I commit to continuing the process.

Sincere thanks to you, Charles, Jason and all participants. Please keep up the great work.


Thank you for sharing your process.




Employees and Bosses


When the relationship is working


problem solving seems to go more smoothly.




Sat, 12 Aug 2006



Hi Ed,

Thanks for your response, looks like Fred is at work, I notice my name appears on the FAQ posting for the below email, when I see it I feel 'embarrassed', which is odd because I see no reason to based on its contents, I remember this happened at Cambridge workshop during my snapshot process, you asked me if I felt embarrassed, thanks for assisting me to experience this feeling (again), I will take this to my tribe and try to fully experience my feeling of embarrassment, I see it as an ally now, but have not taken it to the joy point.

Thank you for sharing your process.



The Positive Intention of Embarrassment


Is to inform us

when we are violating

social norms.


Clip: http://www.boundless.org/2002_2003/images/


Fri, 11 Aug 2006


Big Problems

I see this fellow who calls himself a trader and he’s got big problems.

He used to work at [Name] bank and wanted to be a trader, but could never convince anyone on the derivatives trading desk to hire him, so he worked as a ‘support’ person (aka. Water/coffee boy).


When he got tired of being a butt boy, he decided to go into financial sales, and he’s a good salesman, he’s excellent at taking no risk and getting paid to broker the deal.


Times were good for many years, but he always had the dream (pipe dream) of being a trader, so he tried to go to a top business school, but wasn’t smart enough to get into a good one, so he got his CFA. Spent 3 years of his life studying fundamental economics, hedging, interest rates and global trade;


then he stumbled over ‘mechanical long term trend following’, a way for him to trade where he didn’t have to think, all he had to to is follow his system. So he trashes the CFA, doesn’t use it, but still markets himself as one, and doesn’t recognize the contradiction.


Anyway, he follows his system and convinces clients to give him money (deep down he’s a salesman but doesn’t like to admit it), so he gets millions under management, follows his system and begins to have a MASSIVE drawdown …

Now he’s VERY scared, is questioning his system and doesn’t know what to do … To add to the pressure, his clients are getting really scared too.

I tell him to be afraid, be very afraid, and take this feeling to the hot seat.

Any advice or comments is appreciated.

In TTP we generally refrain from offering specific advice or trying to fix people.


You might consider taking your feelings about your friend to the hot seat.





stay friends


by refraining

from trying to fix each other.


Clip: http://students.washington.edu/jenhahn/