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October 1 - 10, 2009


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Contributors Say

(Quotes from Ed in Red)

Ed Says

Friday, October 9, 2009

Swami Sez



The Buddha was once meditating. His mind started creating problems and distracted him from the path of enlightenment. It was as though hundreds of horses were galloping through his mind.


But the monk remained a witness and did not identify with fear. His mind turned into thousands of elephants tempting him to identify with them, but again Buddha was just a witness, he saw through the mind's game. His mind became a loving deer but still Buddha remained a witness. He did not get tempted.

Finally, his mind turned into a loving child drowning in the ocean, seeking his attention. Buddha, out of compassion, merged with his thoughts and stretched out his hands to save the drowning child. At once, the child turned into a monster and started pulling Buddha to the ocean. Buddha realized his folly and left the monster and continued being a witness. The monster turned again into a child and started pleading for help.

Buddha continued his meditation of being, not participating, but being a witness. The child drowned in the ocean and emerged as an enlightened mind, reflecting Buddha's mind. This is a play narrating Buddha's effort towards enlightenment.

Is the shunning of identification an important aspect of meditation?

Learn to be a witness to your thoughts and feelings. In the witnessing consciousness, there is no identification with anything. Identification leads to misery. Worry is a form of identification. Literally, worry means twisting and tearing. Have you observed that when you worry, your moving centre gets twisted? Negative state of worry depression or fear... shows up strongly in the form of twisting one's body-moving centre.

Just be a witness and do not get identified. Relax your body, your mind and then finally just be a witness. Let not your 'I' get identified with your body and mind. This de-identification is meditation.

What about emotions in a state of worry?

Firstly, negative emotional states like that of worry and jealousy must be observed and recognized. Generally, we do not see them. Instead, we become them. While a negative emotion is happening, be an onlooker. Then the emotion will be like a cloud that comes and goes.

To stop a negative emotion that comes out, create a new will through the intellectual centre. This is not suppression as you are doing it with an understanding that if negative emotion is let loose, it will create a hurt body. In turn this hurt body will take control of you.

Worry is a form of identification. It is useless. Unfortunately, many of us think it is right to worry about someone we love. Give up this voluntary form of suffering. By worrying you exhaust yourself. Your energy gets depleted. In a depleted state, one cannot perform to the optimum level. Learn to take small steps, stop worrying. Weed out the worry as it emerges. Do not allow the other centres to support and nourish it.

What do you mean when you say we live in two worlds ?

One is visible and outer while the other is invisible and inner. The outer is your body that is visible. The inner is your psychology. The object of spiritual teaching is to lead a person from unconscious being to conscious being.

-- Swami Sukhabodhananda

In TTP we hold that all feelings have positive intentions.


The next time you see Swami you might suggest he take his feelings about <problems>, <worry> and <jealousy> to Tribe.

Friday, October 9, 2009

See Previous

I do not pretend to not like cats. I don't like cats as pets. I prefer dogs and birds.


Friday, October 9, 2009


Economics: a Definition

Hello Chief Ed,

I thought you'd get some kicks out of this one:


Clip: http://despair.com/economics.html

EcoNowMics is the art and science of relationships as they are in the moment of now.

Thursday, October 8, 2009


EcoNowMics and Monetary Policy and Oz

As I read about historical US monetary policy, I notice a surprisingly popular subject: interpreting / The Wonderful Wizard of OZ / as fiscal allegory. I decide to re-read the book, and put it in context.

In the 1896 presidential election, William McKinley runs on a platform of "sound money"--a gold standard and fixed money supply. His opponent
William Bryan advocates "free silver"--expansion of the money supply though "free" conversion of recently abundant silver into legal tender, 1890's equivalent of printing money. McKinley wins.



In 1900, Frank Baum publishes "The Wonderful Wizard of OZ" . In the book, Dorothy assembles a populist coalition of brainless farmers, heartless industrial workers and--gasp!--cowardly African beasts. Her Silver slippers tread on the Gold brick road, and take her to Emerald City. On the way, her party narrowly escapes Red opiates for the masses. Incidentally, Emerald City is only green by fiat--it is white as paper unless you wear the compulsory green glasses.



In 1901, Leon Czolgosz assassinates McKinley and Vice President Roosevelt becomes President. Theo-dor-othy becomes a trust-buster and champions "elastic currency," an euphemism for inflationary policy. He establishes the National Monetary Commission which recommends creating a Federal Reserve and its Notes, the greenback paper currency in use today.


In 1933, Franklin D. Roosevelt's executive order prohibits possession of gold, removes it from circulation, and debases the dollar from $20.67 to $35 per OZ. Government debt (payable in gold) magically shrinks by 30%. Greenbacks are no longer convertible into Gold.



In 1939, Judy Garland treads on the Yellow brick road in Ruby slippers. The film makes no reference to Red poppies. Emerald City appears Green from inside and out, without any special glasses.




Clips: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:1900McKinley.JPG









Thank you for sharing your insights.

Thursday, October 8, 2009


Testimonial: First Tribe Meeting

Hi Ed,

This is a testimonial about my first experience on the "Hot Seat" with the [City] Chapter ...

This was my first time to a Trading Tribe Meeting ... I read the book so I had some idea of what to expect ... but nothing could have prepared me for what I experienced ...

Just about all of the Tribe members took the Hot Seat and the feelings I felt from the other members when they were on the Hot Seat helped me to let down my guard a little.  The other members didn't hold anything back and it gave me the confidence to try to explore where they were going.

I was invited to the Hot Seat. I honestly don't know what happened to me next - the field of acknowledgement brought out feelings and Forms that pretty much scared me at first, but then I just let it unravel and take it's journey where it wanted to go. At times I was embarrassed, and at times I felt liberated - and more interesting than anything else I didn't know if I could stop it.  The flow of emotions was down right exhausting - my breathing was deep and heavy, my hands moved in jerky uncontrollable spasms.  I got down close to the floor with clenched fists and a rage on my face - I started to laugh and then break down through the whole cycle again.  At one point I felt limp and I didn't know what was going to happen next - the rage came back and my fists stretched out with uncontrolled shakes, my whole body shivered and my breathing quaked - time stood still and I have no idea how long this had been going on or how long it would last. I tried to calm down with heavy breathing until I came back to conscious.


After the meeting I drove home and put myself to bed, the whole night I thought about my experience and I didn't know what to make of it.   Honestly, this experience has changed me and it's too early to know how. I'm not sure if I had an AHA moment, but I think maybe I saw it briefly towards the end.

Ed, this is powerful stuff and I appreciate what you have given me.  You have shown me a window into my soul.

Thank you for sharing your process.

Thursday, October 8, 2009


Feelings of Wanting




You might be wanting

(and getting)

the feeling of wanting.

People Who Play for Sympathy
try to win

by pretending they don't have
what they want.


Thanks. Could you elaborate a bit further on how this works, if possible with another example? I think cats, in general, pretend a lot of things to get what they want and I don't like it.

OK, you might like pretending to not like cats that pretend things to get what they want.

Thursday, October 8, 2009


Wants a Definition

Dear Ed,

What is Quant trading??

I am from a country where Quant trading seems to be the solution in trading for the banks.

Great engineers from Great Schools in Mathematics populate the room market of those big banks as traders. Those schools are more and less the equivalent of your MIT(Massachusset Institute of Technology). But, I've never read a super trader who is a quant trader.

I feel curious and confused about that situation. Strangely, You the Great Ed Seykota never talks about Quant trading on your encyclopedia site; Neither the super traders in Market Wizards I and II...

So my question is, is Quant trading Math-turbation? is it a good distraction that avoids the important task of dealing with the present?

Your answer as an engineer from MIT might be very interesting.

A quant is a type of barge pole with a cap at the top and a prong at the bottom to stop it from sinking into the mud. A quant for a punt, as in punting the Thames, is about 4 meters long; it is either wood or a hollow metal, so it can float.


A quant trader, then, is an Englishman who engages in punt pole commerce.


As a hobby, such a person might also analyze financial information in order to detect relationships, disparities, or patterns that can lead to making money.



Punting the Thames


Clip: http://www.satin.co.uk/Punting.jpg


Wednesday, October 7, 2009




Dear Ed,

Have you been involved in the past with Scientology ?

Just curious

In TTP we hold that every result is everyone's intention; in that regard, I acknowledge you and I creating Scientology and, incidentally, your question about it.

Wednesday, October 7, 2009



Hi Mr. Seykota:

I'm an 18-year-old girl from Barcelona and I'm doing a research work about trading. I've been reading your website, included your name in the work, and I'd appreciate if you answered a couple of simple questions to attach to my work:

1. Long-term trading, middle-term trading or Swing trading??

2. What are your 3 favorite indicators?

3. When did you get interested in the stock market and why?

4. Technical analysis or fundamental analysis?

5. Most important qualities of a successful trader?

6. Put in order of preference: Futures, Options, ETFs, Stocks (best to worst in your opinion)

Thank you very much for your attention.

You might consider taking your feelings about <ambiguity> and <entitlement> to Tribe.

Tuesday, October 6, 2009


EcoNowMics: Capital Formation

Hi Ed,

I continue to think about your paper on capital formation. I wonder about the origin and evolution of the term "Capitalism." I first learn
about it as a child in the Soviet Union, where it describes the antithesis to Communism: first-world countries and pre-revolutionary Russia.

I recall a sense of surprise when I first arrive in America and meet people who describe Capitalism as their preference for social organization. I recall my assumption that Marx's Das Kapital popularizes the noun "capitalist" as a derogative, and that no one self-describes as a capitalist any more than as a carpetbagger or as a copperhead. I recall wondering if the term is a "reclaimed word" in the same sense as "geek" or "dyke" may be.

The Russian of my childhood is full of obscure pejoratives whose meaning eludes analysis. For instance: I recall standard references to Germany under the National Socialist Workers' Party as a Fascist and Capitalist state. Over the years I come to understand what some of the terms actually mean in that language:

White Movement: Russians not under Red control
Menshevism: Socialists not under Lenin's control
Trotskyism: Communists not under Stalin's control
Fascism: Statists not under Soviet control
Capitalism: Governments not under Communist control

I notice that, to the extent that they are part of the English language, some of these words have the same meanings in English. I wonder about the origin and evolution of the term "Capitalism," and whether it is an exception in this list.

Thank you for your comments.

Tuesday, October 6, 2009


Control to Intimacy

Dear Ed (and support team),

I report in on my Big Wave (I give my wife and children all my love and support and I center my relationship on intimacy).

I have many observations about the interaction of my wife with my children. I observe how she expect them to be or act somehow, and how our children rebel. At the same time, my wife reports her admiration about how I cope with the whims of our youngest son.

Something that my wife said some time ago bothers me. I want to talk about it with her. She is elusive and explains. After some minutes, she mentions that something I did six months ago hurt her a lot. I realize that it was very painful for her. I apologize and acknowledge that she felt used. She mentions that I am not apologizing. Her eyes are wet. I see that the event is past, but her sadness happens now. I want to allow her to communicate her feelings, if she wants. I say "it seems to me that you are very sad". She answers quite matter-of-factly "I have tears in my eyes". I say with all my empathy and kindness "Maybe you want to tell me more about it".

I know that this is a magnificent chance to open our hearts, to show our weaknesses, to support each other and to grow. It would be exactly the kind of relationship I have been longing for all these years. I completely open the door for her feelings. When I do this with other people, after five minutes they tell me about their sadness and their pain, their loneliness and their fear, about miscarriages and emotional abuse, about husbands being unsupportive, parents telling them they she should have never been born, fathers hitting them with a ladle, mothers almost bleeding to death during the delivery. I know how intimate this communication is, I know that it liberates and heals.

I mention "A much better communication is possible, a more intimate contact, but to do that it is necessary to be open to share feelings".

My wife says "I can't stand this anymore" and leaves the room.

I realize that, even without my awareness, I was testing her willingness to open up emotionally (Saturday, August 1, 2009: "From Control to Intimacy: Employing Willingness Testing"). I imagine that I do it in a non-controlling way. She refuses. To insist would be suggesting that she is doing something wrong, trying to fix her. And I do not fix people.

But on Friday I think "I do not have an intimate relationship with my wife" and feel really bad. I observe that I ABHOR the feeling. I obviously have a wife who helps Fred to experience the feeling that I hate. Before she changes, I have to change myself. I take the issue to the hotseat; the process is very short and extremely intense. I realize that the feeling is deeply intertwined with "loneliness". I have a remembrance of newborns in the nursery, separated from their mothers for the first time, feeling alone. But separation, loneliness is what allows us to be independent, to carry our own life. I surf the feeling and enjoy it.

During the weekend we talk a lot. My wife mentions that she is "an emotional cripple riding a wheelchair", not even being able to say "I love you". She mentions that nobody ever was so kind to her as I. I remind her that also nobody was ever so insensible to her needs as I was. She tells me that she wants to change, bus asks me for patience and strong nerves. I mention that I could be very patient if I knew the outcome...She thanks me for my love and support, and mentions that she just wants me to be happy. After that, for the first time in years she asks me and sleeps in my arms.

Today is Tuesday. As I leave the house for work, my wife says to me "I love you".

Now I know that I do not judge rejection, loneliness, or sadness. I realize my needs for love, for physical contact, for communication, acceptance and support. I feel that these needs are universal, shared by all FAQ readers...but also by their partners. I learn how I condition the answers of my wife and of my children. I see how I create my own environment, and how I can change it by applying different politics. My spontaneous prompting evolves from "how do I get from this person what I want" over the clumsy "how do I interact the best with this person from an intimacy perspective" to the simple "how do I serve this person the best?". I learn to change people not by force, but by telling them about my needs and seeing if they are open, or just willing to play games with my feelings. Most important, I also learn that intimacy is not taking a pill once and changing your life, it is an exercise routine that you repeat continuously until you master it. And if you stop exercising, well, you lose your edge.

As I accept my feelings, I realize what kind or relationship I need. Maybe my wife can join me, and maybe she cannot.

But this is another story.

I give myself a "pass".

I thank you for your support and, as always, remind you about my need for the disclosure of inconsistencies.



Clip: http://www.slublog.com/archives/


Thank you for sharing you process - and for inspiring many with your accounts along the path from control-centric to intimacy-centric relating.


Per your request for inconsistencies, you might notice that "Mission Accomplished" infers some event in the non-existing past.


"Mission Complete" infers the condition exists now.

Monday, October 5, 2009


Bicycle Magic (Movie)


Dear Ed,


Thought you might like this.



Thank you for the clip.

Monday, October 5, 2009


Closing in on Closure

Dear Tribe;

Another week of blah returns. (This morning I am up 0.1%). I have done a few things of value. Mostly, I've made a mess. I do have a new Microsoft computer, on which to load CSI and Trading Blox. I also managed to delete ALL my emails. And I discovered the emoticons in my email- it's a new feature.

Here's what I am really feeling about my life.

I am disgusted with the lack of closure . Big players are interested in the Company, but they move slowly. The market and I do not see eye to eye. My family. Since, I cannot control other people, I am committing to doing as much closure, within my control. I am Closing until I feel completely caught up.

I wrote that last Tuesday- and immediately felt better. I continue to clean and close- I am feeling good, not complete but better. One thing I realized was that not finishing things creates a sort of drag on everything, I am dragging my baggage around. Closure means I do not have to be apologizing for not getting anything completed. Closure makes me feel cleaner and lighter.

6 days gym
Zero days travel
6 days EcoNowMics

Thank you for sharing your process.


You might consider taking your feelings about <moving slowly> to Tribe.

Monday, October 5, 2009


Fred and Ralph

Hello Mr. Ed

Greetings from [Country]! I just returned from a short vacation feeling rejuvenated.

I wish to narrate an incident about a cousin sister who travelled with us in SUV. It was a 10 hour journey in a day on roads in the hinterlands. Recent monsoon rains have created havoc on already fragile road network.

My cousin sister approaching 60th birthday, has had a very bad history of motion (travel) sickness hence was very worried and nervous as usual at the start of our journey. As always, she began complaining about it. I suggested her to tell herself "she doesn't have any issues with travel sickness" She agreed to it and we all purposefully did not talk about motion sickness throughout the day in the car.

Lo and behold! She had a wonderful journey without any problem of vomiting!

I listened to Ed's superb number...."Every time you say how it is, that's the way it's going to be for you!" on personal mp3 player at least 6-7 times that day!

As Earl Nightingale says..."Whatever we plant in our subconscious mind and nourish with repetition and emotion will one day become a reality."

Thanks Ed for having a profound positive impact on so many people!

Thank you for sharing your process.



Sunday, October 4, 2009


TSP Question on Exponential Average

Hi Ed,

Thanks for all the information on your web site!

I am trying to reproduce the results for the 15/150 and 85/325 Exponential Average Systems. I have succeeded apart from the bliss results. I am getting the wrong bliss as I am getting the incorrect draw down value.


According to the formula, PDD = Retracement / Peak where Retracement = Peak - Subsequent Low.


I am using the equity at the end of a completed trade only. Is that the correct value to use? Or should I be using the more dynamic equity, based on the closing price at the end of each day, whilst a trade is in progress?


For the 15/150 system my PDD is from the peak of 23/09/1986 of 1634550.0 to the 21/11/1988 low of 994206.25. This gives a PDD of 0.3918 instead of the answer that you give: 0.6090. Can you tell me where I am going wrong?

The systems in TSP figure the metrics at the close of every day.

Saturday, October 3, 2009


Wants Differential Diagnosis of Medication

Hi Ed,

I spend a lot of time and energy medicating my feelings. What is the difference in medicating my feelings with working out or meditating, which gives me a positive boost to my body / brain / endorphins, or other positive “medications” vs. overeating, overspending (shopping), etc?


Are the positive “medications” actually a doorway into experiencing my true feelings or a stepping stone to right livelihood?

The test for medicinal behavior in the TTP sense is not substance-specific.


The test is whether engaging the substance (or drama) moves you closer to - or further away from - Right Livelihood.

Saturday, October 3, 2009


The Other Fred


A different Fred has this to say about the Causal Model, and its relation to Fear:

"To trace something unknown back to something known is alleviating, soothing, gratifying and gives moreover a feeling of power. Danger, disquiet, anxiety attend the unknown - the first instinct is to eliminate these distressing states. First principle: any explanation is better than none... The cause-creating drive is thus conditioned and excited by the feeling of fear ..." Friedrich Nietzsche

Thank you for your report on Fred N.

Friday, October 2, 2009


Wanting to Want



Do you really believe everybody gets everything they want? I am afraid I don't have "everything" I want... Do you?

You might be wanting (and getting) the feeling of wanting.




People Who Play for Sympathy


try to win

by pretending they don't have

what they want.



Clip: http://www.themadmusicarchive.com/


Friday, October 2, 2009


20 Million Ears

Dear Ed,

It's a pleasure to speak to you. 20 million ears hear my band play yesterday morning on live radio, pretty cool!



Thank you for sharing your process.


Hmmm... 20 million ears indicates 10 million heads and, well, 2.06 billion bones.


I notice you are still rocking with your forms at:




Friday, October 2, 2009

Seeking Members

Hello Mr. Seykota,

I recently purchased your book and came to the important realization that if I was going to succeed in trading, I would have to confront my discomfort with regards to being wrong. I have explored the possibility of the Do It Myself, but per your expertise, DIM is not nearly as effective.

Although I had previously contacted the [Name], they were not responsive in their email. I have decided to start a Detroit Trading Tribe in efforts to recruit members in the area for a local tribe.

I have enclosed a TTID in hopes that other people from any walks of life would be interested in forming a trading tribe.

Thank you for sharing your knowledge and wisdom. I appreciate your generosity.






Thursday, October 1, 2009


Since my childhood I usually hear "après l'effort, le réconfort" that means "after effort, comfort!". My parents, my teachers, my professors (...) all have taught me that; and I accepted and integrated this statement as a way of life.

Now, I think that this statement does not work in Right Livelihood. I think that "the comfort is in the pleasure of the effort" isn't it?

"After effort, comfort!" matches with some of my friends' way of life. They work with effort for 11 months without pleasure by dragging their foot, and they spend 1 month of holiday per year to get moment of comfort.

Thank you to teach us that only now exists.

Thank you for sharing your process.


At the Zero Point, effort, comfort and Right Livelihood merge.

Thursday, October 1, 2009


Mirror, Mirror on the Wall



How do I get trading results like Ed?

Like Ed, you get the trading results you get.


Your Results, Like a Mirror


reflects your intentions.


This is the same for other traders,

and for Ed.


Clip: http://www.sharebook.co.kr/disney/a/




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